Anyway, I… the next year George P Elliott, who was a very close friend at that time, you knew… you knew George. He… he helped me get a job at Rochester and I was told that would only be for… it was either one… one or two years. The… the lady who was in head… charge of the department said, 'We have already got one poet on the staff and I had to fight so hard to get him on that I can't fight to get another one on, so… so you can stay for a year'  — or was it two? — I don't remember. Well, in the middle of that I got a fellowship from the Hudson Review and so then I quit that year anyway, and it was from there that I went to Detroit. But Detroit was a… was a… a very reveal… especially after my second marriage broke up, you know, I was looking for something to do at night, and my students would take me to the belly dance joints and to the… to whatever their ethnic group had going, and it… it was… it was a very fascinating place.