Talking to patients about things. I mean, like you, I've done a huge amount of it and I'm sure I've done a lot of it completely wrong. I mean one thing I know I did wrong, I tended to over-explain. I was so keen on the patient understanding where we were at, that I think I said too much detail really. I'm sure a lot of them went away and said when they got home, 'Yeah, he seemed all right but I don't know what the hell he was talking about'. I mean no long words just you know.

[Q] But you were very unusual, weren't you, in doing that, Harold?

I don't think so.

[Q] That's my... my feeling that actually a lot of people didn't do very much explaining at all so that actually most people were just told what to do and, and left in the dark.

Yes. I think that's partly the people, that's true, and partly the, the climate of the times. It was a much more authoritarian climate and the doctor knew best and some people I found incredibly difficult to talk were ex-servicemen, you know, hair slicked down, standing at attention in bed, 'Yes sir, no sir'. 'Yeah, well, this is the situation, Mr Brown, and we're going to cut your head off tomorrow'. 'Just as you say doctor'. I mean that was the sort of sight. It was impossible to get them to come across and say what they felt about it. So it was both sides of the equation I think, but it's a very interesting thing and we're talking about this at a very junior level but I think actually these are nuggets which are incredibly important.

[Q] But you must have seen that change in patients as well as in doctors.

Yeah.. that's right. Yeah, I think so, very much in recent years with... and of course with the web it's changed entirely. I mean that business about notes with the doctor, patients in my generation always felt very shy of this, bringing up bits of paper. I used to say, 'Do this, you'll forget and bring up some notes', and when I was ill some years ago they came and had chats with me, very nice, my colleagues, you know, and when they went away I thought: oh no, what I've really got is this and I forgot to mention that! And so I think it's very important for patients to have notes about what they want to say to you.