When you came back to Baroda as a teacher, was there a sense in which you were pushing slightly against the dominance of abstraction and towards... true, it was at a certain time you might call a post-Bendre phase.

At the time this school started, I mean there was one side, Bendre, who was very much taken up with what was called the high mark, the high water mark, so modern art, like the work of Picasso, Braque, Matisse, this sort of a thing, and then later of course even those action painters. He even sort of showed his students some of the examples of this work. They were affected by what he... but at that time a person like me was saying that well, they should be as sort of seriously affected by what they see around and what they see in their tradition, which is not terribly different. Maybe they are different in outlook, but in terms of the object. So there was, and later when I came to be the head of the department, I wanted that this extent, to the extent of you are reacting to the scene around, and some of my younger colleagues and then some of my sort of students, as resourceful students of that time, they caught up with it and they sort of took it into the field of sort of an emotional reaction, or trying to sort of interpret what is going around, or symbolise what is going around. That was there and I was very happy to do it.