And then I did some studying on my own and I must have taken some courses or other, and then I came to this exam and flunked it. But I flunked it in an interesting way. I flunked in an interesting way in that I was able to answer some of the questions, but not in the way a physicist would answer them, just in some mathematics way, and so on. So they said, 'Well, you know, we don't know exactly what to do with you, but you have to take this course in experimental physics with RV Pound.' I said, 'Oh, all right.'

Meanwhile I was actually writing my thesis in physics, because there was a young guy called Abe Klein was an instructor who had no students, and so I was… he was willing to take me. So I was starting my thesis with him, and then I took this course in experimental physics. Pound recently died. He was a wonderful guy, really marvellous. And I think he sort of understood what was going on and he was very tolerant. And I had a very good lab partner, who was very, very helpful. So I managed to pass that thing.