So I called her up because a friend, Zevi Jaffe from college, who unfortunately is no longer alive, gave me two telephone numbers, hers and Marie Lesnik, a mathematician in Brooklyn. I went out with Marie Lesnik a couple of times, I didn't hit it off. And I called up Denise, and she had no interest in going out with me. And I tried various things, didn't work. And then I finally dropped that I was from Vienna and I could see that interest picked up. She thought, if he's European he can't be all bad. So she agreed to go out with me, and I asked her whether she wanted to go to the movies or the best bar in town. And she said let's go to the best bar in town. So it turns out in our apartment we built a wonderful bar… Bob Goldberger, later became provost at the medical school, he was a couple of years behind me, but we'd been friends in college, so he roomed with me. We roomed together near NYU medical school. And we had a modest sized but very nice apartment. And he was into whiskey in a big way. I don't mean he was a drinker, but he knew good whiskeys, he was much more affluent than I was. And so we had a wonderful bar. He also was a very good carpenter and things like this. So I took her there. She'd actually… she didn't like whiskey, so we had something else. And this was, you know, shocking for our period, and but nonetheless she was really quite game, and we very rapidly became good friends. And I think I told you this before, way before I was prepared to get married, she wanted to get married. I was uncertain and for me it was a leap of faith, and you know, you sometimes have to make those decisions. I was worried my parents fought periodically, and she said, of course people fight. But you know, it's how you resolve it.

[Q] Great.

There is a wonderful painting of me that Denise made on our honeymoon which… I don't know if you ever saw it. It's hanging in our apartment, you'll see it when you come up. It's different than a Kathy Hilten, but Kathy did it at a different phase of my life. This is an oil. Wonderful. Yes. Actually quite wonderful. She only did two paintings in her whole life, both on our honeymoon. That and a landscape. We lost the landscape somewhere along the line.