When I was young, coming from the family that I came from, there was only one possible university for me to join that was the Catholic University of Louvain. So I went to study at the Catholic University... I'm sorry I should have said that, but at that time was obvious, no other university was conceivable. So, let’s go back to the story, whatever, I was telling.

[Q] So you'd got to the point...

Yes. So anyway, as I... I said I had discovered science and fallen in love with it.

[Q] And it was difficult to finish your studies?

To finish... it was difficult to finish my studies but I did so. But, another interesting thing was that Bouckaert, who was the head of the physiology lab, had a very strange way of organising his laboratory. He felt that research in his lab should reflect his teaching, and so there should be a group working on each major chapter of physiology. Now how he was able to do that, with the very, very, very small budget that the university... the Catholic University at that time, was extremely poor, it lived on whatever money people gave at... on two Sundays in the churches. It was very poor, it paid its professors very poorly, if anything, because many of the professors actually enjoyed private means and refused to be paid by the university and... not Bouckaert, he wasn't wealthy. And so, I think to some extent his lab was paid by the students, by the medical students because they organised practical classes for the medical students and the medical students had to pay a fee for the practical classes and part of the fee went to... into the research part of the laboratory. Anyway, I think that's how it happened. Anyway, he had... he had several groups, mostly students like myself, but there were two or three senior people who conducted the research. But so he had a group working on heart, he had a group working on kidney, he had a group working on... nerves, the brain, he had a group working on metabolism, he had a group working on diabetes and insulin. It really covered almost the whole field. And so, when I was accepted in the lab I was sort of given the menu and asked which group would I want to join.