Hilary was a virologist, he was a polio vaccine pioneer, he knew that cell culture by this time was important, and the field was by this time was becoming important in the lives of many people. So I happened to be very fortunate in entering the field almost at its inception, I should say its renaissance, because it technically began in 1900 with some significant events occurring between 1900 and 1958 which is when I arrived at the Wistar Institute, but I'll return to those significant events later, in a later context. Also Hilary was... knew many of the world's leading virologists, many geneticists, he also had a personality very much like Charlie Pomerat. He was an exceptionally good host. He was well spoken. He was a charming person. An excellent researcher, lots of foresight, that's on the plus side. On a minus side, he was known that if you crossed him in any way that offended him or went against his wishes, he could be a very serious foe. And that side of him was also known. But it should be said that he was a charming person, and I... I, on the whole, enjoyed him as a boss with some exceptions that are referred to later.